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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:07 pm |
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92 2.3 cab bought on ebay with engine problems. No problem, I have a 93 80tdi (1Z engine) and enthusiasm (for the time being!!)
The 80 Tdi was my friends parents car, who used it for many years before getting another car. They kept the 80 as a farm runabout to go between two farms on a private road (no mot, red diesel). They stopped using the car when it developed starting problems, then sat gathering cobwebs for a few years.
I got the car last year then had a look at the starting problems!! The car would turn over and fire, though would only run for a second before stopping!
No problems, a new fuel filter then tickety boo!! Err,,no! Oh well... Gallon can of diesel and hose into filter head then surely....
No....
Top of inj pump to have a look. Nothing amiss though NO!!
Eventually traced it to the cat being full of soot!! The car was only driven for 1/2 a mile 4 times a day so wouldn't heat up enough to get the cat warm, or fast enough to blast the soot out the exhaust!!
The cab seems to have a very sound body with only a bit of rust on the front drivers wing. It seems to have been waxoyled lots of times and the chassis is solid.
I dont know too much about the cabs and i will have a few things to sort out (hopefully with the help of the forum)
Cheers Jim |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:23 pm |
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So where have I got to?
Tdi! Engine out, dashboard out. Engine and radiator wiring looms removed (with a few choice words!!). Photos taken of the wiring to help. Didnt take photos of the engine removal cause I thought I'd remember.
Starting to take the 2.3 out of the cab.
Took out the petrol tank to see about the hose layout. There seems to be 2 delivery hoses at the bottom of the tank. Does anyone know which one would be the best to use for a diesel. (I will prob use the large hose unless advised otherwise)
Another difference seem to be the driveshafts! I was hoping the driveshafts would just bolt onto the diesel gearbox.
Back to the grindstone,,, or was it the angle grinder.
Cheers
Jim |
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Hammer n' chisel at the ready |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:27 am |
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You need to use both lines for the diesel. One is a return and one is the feed. The transfer pump built into the main injector fuel pump, pumps at a constant rate. From memory once the body of the pump is full and pressurised the excess fuel spills back to the tank.
Post your pictures up ...this is one I hope to copy at some point in my life
Pic below is the diesel plumbing on the diesel cab.(identical to the audi 80 far as I can see.)
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_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:33 am |
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Remember that you need to change the fuel tank from a narrow neck petrol one to a wide neck diesel one.Although it might be an insert that makes the diameter change. The part numbers for the diesel and petrol tank are different.
Unfortunately the Audi 80 saloon is a completely different tank shape . The filler neck is the only reason I can think of a difference.
PS I notice that the fuel level sender is different revision between diesel and petrol. Dont think its show stopping. The only other difference is the breather pipe which goes to the activated carbon canister on the petrol. Can probably just delete that bit and leave a drip tube.
The petrol fuel pump and accumulator can be deleted. |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:11 pm |
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Hi, don't think the fuel tank is going to be the problem with this change! I think a screwdriver will sort the filler neck! There's a wee bit of plastic that reduces the diameter so.......
About the fuel lines, there are 2 coming out of the bottom of the tank (that's why petrols use more fuel ) and a return going in the top! The two delivery hoses on the bottom are different diameter(large going to electric pump and filter, smaller onto a metal pipe to the front) There are also a couple of hoses on the top of the tank which I think will act as vents when you fill as the tank is shallow in the middle because of the ski hole thingy!! |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:22 pm |
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A couple of photos of most of the interior before it came out!! |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:42 pm |
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Next onto the interior of the cab! the interior of the tdi got kinda savaged to get to the wiring harnesses, though I took care to get the soundproofing that was around the trans tunnel/ bulkhead area out intact. If it fits I will try to put it in when rebuilding. I took care removing the interior of the cab because I'd like to keep it half decent when it goes back together!!
I did however have a problem taking out the footrest on the tunnel as I savaged it ho hum... |
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Last edited by DieselJim on Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:49 pm |
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Engine out!! |
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Wave the magic wand and....... |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:33 pm |
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Way cool. Keep the photos coming!!
The wiring harness is going to be interesting.I had hoped it could be done without taking the dash out. |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:16 pm |
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Possibly could have left the dash in though think i've problems with the wiring!! I put the diesel engine/ heater looms in and there are loom plug problems! the tdi has 3 electrical connections on the pedals! the cab only has 1 for the brake light switch, the tdi has 2 switches on the brake pedal and one on the clutch!! I've already taken out the pedal box to put in the diesel one because of the fly by wire on the tdi. the fly by wire is no prob because it just plugs into the diesel loom! The problem is the additional wiring for the other pedal switches!!
The options are to:
remove the cab switchgear wiring and replace with the tdi switchgear wiring
see if it is possible to remove the tdi wiring required and piggy back it onto the cab loom
Anyone got any wiring diagrams to help?
HHEEELLLLPPPP |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:34 pm |
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Unfortunately the wiring diagrams that are on-line are all for the petrol cabriolet and petrol 80.
http://www.isham-research.co.uk/quattro/wiring/TypB4/
http://www.autolib.diakom.ru/CAR/Audi/1997/Cabriolet/SYSTEM%20WIRING%20DIAGRAMS/
I have a set of the Audi 80 wiring diagrams which covers the TDI but will need to check if it covers past 1993 and need to find a scanner.
There is a good VAG overview of the TDI system showing all the input signals for the TDI somewhere on line (cannot find it at the moment) it includes the clutch and brake switches - You will need these. |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Wed Dec 14, 2011 9:05 pm |
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There is an english version of this document somewhere on the net but I cannot find it. The german version is better than nothing.
http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_153.PDF
I have pulled the OEM wiring diagrams and will get them scanned tomorrow. They are Audi 80 Edition 06.93 for the 1Z . The aux panel under the dash looks a bit different from your picture but I will scan and let you decode.
PS - found it in English!
http://www.haywood-sullivan.com/vanagon/TDI/tdi-technik-eng.pdf |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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Mikes2
Site Moderator
Joined: Jan 31, 2003
Posts: 9144
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Posted:
Thu Dec 15, 2011 12:31 am |
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I've got loads of TDi wiring diagrams.
Which ones are you after ? Engine, instruments ? What else |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:13 pm |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Fri Dec 23, 2011 9:49 pm |
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Sorry bout the silence at the moment! There's a chunky guy in a red suit coming our way in a couple of days and he seems to take up a lot of time!!
I am having a go at the wiring when I get a chance. I had to take out the petrol dash loom and am adding in the extra wires from the petrol cab loom( front fogs,cigarette light er extension etc. I've also got a hold of an air-con set up from a v6 coupe so......... if anyone has any pics of an 80 tdi with air con I could do with any info, or even any 80 with air con. I could do with measurements of where i need to cut out the bulkhead for the cooling pipes
cheers,
(hammer and chisel in hand)
Jim |
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Mikes2
Site Moderator
Joined: Jan 31, 2003
Posts: 9144
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Posted:
Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:10 pm |
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Hi,
Yes, there are some specific cabriolet wiring diagrams. There are also saloon and Coupe ones also and they're always slightly different
I've been adding a few extra diagrams to the s2 site lately.
I'll add a seperate page shortly. Won't be long |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Jan 01, 2012 9:38 pm |
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Where am I at now?
Given up on electrics for a bit, thought I'd have a look at the engine!
Read on the forum to have a look at the inlet manifold and
Don't know how many horses have been throttled trying to get into the cylinders!! |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Jan 01, 2012 9:58 pm |
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No rest for the wicked!
Out with the valves, out with the gunge, out with the drill and grinding paste!
Might as well do it before the engine is in situ.
Anyway the bores look like new, so for a few bob its peace of mind! |
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Just unbelievable how much gunge was in the inlet chambers!!!! |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Sun Jan 01, 2012 10:09 pm |
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More pics of the head
new stem seals used
Can't put the camshaft on because I forgot to get a new end seal!!
Back to the wiring then!! |
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Last edited by DieselJim on Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:44 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:27 pm |
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Unbelievable! I have had two tdi both up to 200k. The one I have at the moment runs on veg oil and the power is excellent, but the EGR must be depositing the same gunk in the inlet. The turbo must squeeze the air past the gunk... but clearly your going to get way more power out the engine once its cleaned.
keep the photos coming |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Mon Jan 02, 2012 9:55 pm |
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Nothing spectacular today!
Finally converted the petrol tank into a diesel one.......with a screwdriver. Petrol tank has a green bit of plastic in it that stops the larger diameter diesel delivery pipe go in. If anyone has the parts diagram for the diesel cab fuel tank could they post it up to I see how it should be compared with how this one will |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:00 pm |
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I've looked at this for a while now...... and to be honest I don't know what it is!! Think I'm going to get a Homer Simpson Doh!!! |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:24 pm |
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Help needed!!
On the Cab the roof open warning lamp is in the same position as the heater plug warning lamp of the tdi!!. As I am going to use the tdi clocks and warning lamp cluster, does anyone know if it would be possible to re position the roof open warning lamp to a spare position on the tdi cluster (ie cut out the roof open symbol from the cab warning symbol board then stick it onto the tdi's. I'd then need to find the roof open wire on the cab loom then get it to the new place on the tdis (I think I understand what I'm trying to do)) . If anyone has the cab wiring it would be appreciated. |
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Cab warning display. Roof open is where the Tdi glow lamp is (I think). I think the one below is free on the tdi!! |
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Mikes2
Site Moderator
Joined: Jan 31, 2003
Posts: 9144
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Posted:
Mon Jan 02, 2012 11:15 pm |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Tue Jan 03, 2012 10:14 pm |
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DieselJim wrote: | I've looked at this for a while now...... and to be honest I don't know what it is!! Think I'm going to get a Homer Simpson Doh!!! |
The roof pump normally goes there. If its a manual roof then they install a dummy part which acts as a crash absorber. (I think) |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:10 pm |
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DieselJim wrote: | Help needed!!
On the Cab the roof open warning lamp is in the same position as the heater plug warning lamp of the tdi!!. . |
This is a difficult one. Think the lamps get there power off the circuit board so difficult to rewire. The main printed circuit board for clocks seems to be the same between the petrol cab 4 cylinder and the diesel cab 4 cylinder. But you need to check you model years and if they are VDO. The Rev counter is different diesel to petrol as is the card with the light symbols on it. Is your original cab a six cylinder as it has a CAT warning light? - this has a different circuit board
My initial reaction was to use the cab clocks and dump the glow plug light. You hardly ever need to watch the glow plug light as its such a good starter. The only issue is that some audi 80 TDI were fitted with a water detector in the fuel filter which flashes the glow plug light. Its important as the older pumps are very sensitive to water and very expensive to replace. You can see the wires on this diagram at the bottom of the fuel filter. If this was not fitted to the original 80 TDI then I would not worry about it.
Think all these lights are an added complication that do not stop the car running.
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_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:14 pm |
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DieselJim wrote: | If anyone has the parts diagram for the diesel cab fuel tank could they post it up to I see how it should be compared with how this one will |
The tanks the same drawing diesel to petrol but the part number 1 for the tank changes revision. |
_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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Mikes2
Site Moderator
Joined: Jan 31, 2003
Posts: 9144
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Posted:
Wed Jan 04, 2012 9:17 pm |
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DieselJim
Audi Nut
Joined: Dec 01, 2011
Posts: 96
Location: Lanark
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Posted:
Wed Jan 04, 2012 9:54 pm |
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Thanks v much for putting up the cab wiring diags, if only I could understand them
Thanks also for the tank drawing. I wondered if the diesel had parts 5 and 6. They look like a vent system to balance the fuel level in the tank. Any chance of the fuel line drawing for the diesel cab? |
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CCV6
Bandwidth Buster
Joined: Feb 22, 2010
Posts: 668
Location: Glasgow
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Posted:
Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:25 pm |
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DieselJim wrote: |
Thanks also for the tank drawing. I wondered if the diesel had parts 5 and 6. They look like a vent system to balance the fuel level in the tank. Any chance of the fuel line drawing for the diesel cab? |
Yes the design is the same on both the petrol and diesel cabriolet. Part 5 is the breather overflow pipe and 6 is the expansion tank (on the diagram above).
The diagram below is the diesel feed and return pipework. The breather part 5 (above) feeds in to part 10 below and spills to the ground. Part 3 below is the feed line and part 4 in the return both seem to go to the bottom of the tank.
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_________________ Audi Cabriolet 2.8 2000
Audi A4 TDI 2000 (180k on Veg oil)
Audi 80 TDI 1993 (190k) Written off
Passat 1979 scrapped
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